New learning norms
How has the return of nurseries, schools, universities, colleges and other educational settings affected you?
Why the contribution is important
The Scottish Government has committed to engaging with the public and is interested to hear your thoughts on this topic.
by ScottishGovernment on October 05, 2020 at 08:58AM
Posted by Nicamb October 05, 2020 at 16:23
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Posted by NyRw October 05, 2020 at 16:32
Ensuring all pupils have the technology they need to achieve in their education - whether at home or in school - is vital. Technology is mentioned numerous times in the guidance for teachers on reopening schools and has been given a great deal of emphasis in the advice for Learning and Teaching within specific subjects - this technology is yet to materialise in most cases.
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Posted by Angelaahill October 05, 2020 at 17:16
Blended learning is all very well for people who are in two parent families. For a large part of the population who have young kids and full time jobs it's impossible.
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Posted by VictoriaW October 05, 2020 at 17:47
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Posted by AnyaHill October 05, 2020 at 17:52
Some people will need to send their children to school, but others can support blended learning at home. The fewer children in school, the lower the chance of COVID spread and the safer it will be for everyone. If you allow this graduated approach, it will be both safer and more effective in terms of education.
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Posted by Trp October 05, 2020 at 17:59
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Posted by angel October 05, 2020 at 18:02
The only way to reduce the spread is to change to blended learning to allow for smaller class sizes and physical distancing. Masks should also be mandatory in all indoor settings.
Any pupils or teachers with underlying health conditions or with family members who have underlying conditions must work from home to protect lives.
A short, strict two week lockdown is also needed over the school holidays to break chains of transmission and get numbers down.
The data is clear that the spread is driven by educational settings first and then work place settings so measures put in place to stop people socialising will not work until the spread in educational establishments is addressed.
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Posted by LC70 October 05, 2020 at 18:08
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Posted by Maagar October 05, 2020 at 18:16
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Posted by Jane1000 October 05, 2020 at 18:21
The harm to date is that community transition enters schools not schools driving infection rates. Children pose surely minimal risk to the community given they can't enter other houses and they aren't old enough for evening hospitality. Schools being open is a managed risk.
The risk to schools not being open is substantial. Educationally, socially and particularly for those most disadvantaged.
My own experience in schools closing was not positive. The school is usually great, but there was no face to face teaching. My younger child got confused and stressed re what was being asked of her, my older child is worried it will affect her higher study this year and her ability to enter uni with the grades she wants.
Full time schools unless it can demonstrably be shown and clearly evidenced that the risk outweighs the benefit. I'm not seeing now that it does.
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Posted by massimop October 05, 2020 at 18:27
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Posted by Ursula October 05, 2020 at 18:27
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Posted by Ursula October 05, 2020 at 18:29
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Posted by Callendar October 05, 2020 at 18:39
Mask wearing should also be mandatory in corridors for all schools and not just secondary.
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Posted by Lharris12 October 05, 2020 at 19:13
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Posted by Avocado October 05, 2020 at 19:17
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Posted by Spuddie79 October 05, 2020 at 19:22
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Posted by StephIhoe October 05, 2020 at 19:30
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Posted by Jules1907 October 05, 2020 at 19:37
Schools must remain a priority in terms of staying open.
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Posted by Kayrob October 05, 2020 at 19:43
It is also unfair on the children who have remained in school or kept up with their work, they will now need to revisit the work already done to allow the ones who couldn't to keep up with the curriculum.
If people feel the need to keep their kids out of school to home school then they should be allowed... its their perogative. But our children need the education and interaction with other children.
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Posted by harlequinn October 05, 2020 at 20:05
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Posted by WKD234 October 05, 2020 at 20:22
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Posted by alileslie October 05, 2020 at 20:22
Transmission is not driven by schools. Those cases identified in schools have occurred through community transmission and have not spread through schools and nurseries. Children are not driving transmission and we must protect their social and emotional wellbeing.
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Posted by kaz618 October 05, 2020 at 20:24
A home learning environment didn't really work for us and caused so much tension and arguments and now that we've returned to work its not something we could return to doing.
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Posted by Charlotta October 05, 2020 at 20:36
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Posted by O52O2O October 05, 2020 at 20:37
People also need to think of teachers' health. It seems like a lot of people view school as a babysitting service and base their views on this rather than the potential risks of kids being back at school full time during a pandemic, with limited/no social distancing in place.
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Posted by Lornab13 October 05, 2020 at 21:06
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Posted by Feea October 05, 2020 at 21:20
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Posted by Morrisc0502 October 05, 2020 at 21:20
BLENDED LEARNING IS NOT THE ANSWER for primary and secondary schools.
These developing years in a child’s life are so important for them to progress in society and working life. We cannot risk children loosing out on their education for up to two, three years.
It’s a recipe for disaster.
Children have the right to an education, they have a right to be nurtured. Their health and mental well-being depends on it. Children’s needs and health should always come before the people that teach them. As do patients over the people that care for them throughout our nhs. Some of us have to put our health on the line for the greater good, and providing an education for our future generations is no different.
Schools must only close as a last resort. However as someone who has used both the hubs and the return to primary school I have been very impressed with the way the authorities have implemented measures to protect the balance of education and spread of the virus.
It’s working. Don’t change it
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Posted by Kerrie79 October 05, 2020 at 21:33
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Posted by JudyL October 05, 2020 at 21:52
My teenage sons mental health suffered terribly during lockdown.
Since going back to school and interacting with his friends and in person learning he is back to his energetic, happy and funny self.
Children and young people must not be collateral damage.
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Posted by GillianForHealth October 05, 2020 at 22:25
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Posted by thistlerose October 05, 2020 at 22:44
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Posted by montyred October 05, 2020 at 22:46
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Posted by Jason2488 October 05, 2020 at 23:15
S4-S5 - S6 / College / University Students - must be given a better blended learning approach. (1 Term in 1 Term Remote there are many ideas that can be placed here )
Some courses yes need alot more hands on like Engineering / Animals / Medical. These should rightly be allowed to go ahead.
Other courses units / elements can be done remotely should be this should be enshrined in law.
Why cram 100% of University Students in to unfit building for social distancing and potentially wreck the health of the future generation. When a bit of common sense and careful planning would allow a good percentage to stay at home and reduce the risks to others.
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Posted by CatMacIdeas October 05, 2020 at 23:38
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Posted by lauz84 October 06, 2020 at 00:26
that transmission of new ‘cases’ isn’t being driven up by kids! They deserve better! They are being harmed mentally with the restrictions & silly rules like ‘no singing’ but its better than online/blended - they need routine, structure & proper targeted learning from qualified professionals!
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Posted by LeiaAvra October 06, 2020 at 06:08
How can all the students sit together at a fast food restaurant or a pub and not in a class?
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Posted by Cmckenna October 06, 2020 at 06:39
First of all — how am I supposed to work and teach my child? I lost a huge amount of income over lockdown because I wasn’t able to focus on work and helping my son complete his assignments. He’s young Primary age and cannot he left to figure it out on his own. Meanwhile, the toddler was left to watch CBeebies for hours on end and was getting none of the stimulation he would normally get at his nursery.
Second - I am not a teacher. I have no teacher training, and have absolutely no idea how to teach primary school. It is so unfair to put the responsibility of my children’s education on me when our primary school has not had one single case of confirmed COVID. That’s a disproportionate response to this pandemic.
Third - blended education is a disaster to closing the gender pay gap. Yes, I earn less than my husband due to the inherent discrimination against women in the working world, despite me having a master's degree and him not. So the responsibility of education now falls on me. Why did I even bother going to university?
Since being back at school and nursery in August, my boys have thrived. They have come on leaps and bounds in terms of their development, despite my best efforts sacrifices during lockdown. Please don’t close schools and early years centres again. It is a disproportionate response and harms not only our children, but so many parts of what was once a progressive society.
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Posted by Singleworkingmum October 06, 2020 at 08:41
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Posted by JoMacD October 06, 2020 at 09:38
Our children cannot be thrown under the bus again. They need to be prioritised and valued for the future.
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Posted by Ang October 06, 2020 at 10:07
I think blended learning should be till at least after Christmas holidays
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Posted by getusoutofhere October 06, 2020 at 10:22
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Posted by JaneMurray October 06, 2020 at 12:04
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Posted by essess October 06, 2020 at 13:03
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Posted by JeniaFinegan October 06, 2020 at 15:43
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Posted by JeniaFinegan October 06, 2020 at 15:46
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Posted by PoppyG October 06, 2020 at 21:34
For blended learning to work, secondary schools need to be a lot better prepared with a digital strategy on how to run classes on-line, how to engage the children and provide feedback on their work. During lockdown, the provision of on-line learning has been inconsistent from teacher to teacher, no work produced was marked, limited teacher availability and a lack of leadership from education department.
We need to keep schools open.
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Posted by DrSaraParvis October 06, 2020 at 21:44
Universities are communities which depend on sharing ideas. It's easy enough to get everyone to social distance and wear face coverings in a teaching context- they're all adults. Sure, people who need or want to stay at home and teach and learn online should do so. But if it's safe for schools to be open, it's surely safe also for Universities, as long as the necessary measures are in place.
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Posted by AlisonL October 07, 2020 at 09:53
My child has just started P1 this year and her school has been great. Her confidence is gaining and she is loving it. Blended learning would not be an option- during lockdown she didn’t want to engage with anyone over zoom. Most of my friends said the same about their kids that they didn’t really interact with computer.
For people coming close to exams - blended learning would be a disaster - maybe fine if a parent is able to help out or employ a tutor but for many school children this will not be an option and they will disengage. Particularly the ones who need help most. The social divide will just get bigger.
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Posted by christine1001 October 07, 2020 at 19:18
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Posted by tama October 09, 2020 at 14:20
But I'm worried about my child and my husband's health and my own health since she's gone back to school. For me, health is more important than education especially considering how dangerous Covid-19 is.
Many studies show that children play a role in spreading coronavirus. Family members can get coronavirus from children.
https://www.news-medical.ne[…]nsmit-SARS-CoV-2-virus.aspx
We don't know how the virus will affect children's health in the future.
Also there are adults who suffer from long covid disorder.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54296223
(Will the government help people financially if they become ill long term and cannot work or study??)
I strongly believe that both primary and secondary should move to blended learning, so that schools can try the approach to see if it works and they can fix problems for the winter.
Coronavirus can spread via airborne droplets, so face masks should be worn all day at school except for lunch time at both primary and secondary schools. Exemptions would apply for children who cannot tolerate masks for health reasons.
https://www.who.int/news-ro[…]tion-prevention-precautions
Also good ventilation is important.
http://www.freshair.wales/
If this is not possible, please give parents/carers a right to decide whether to send kids to schools and please give children authorised absence.
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Posted by ShieldedGrandad October 10, 2020 at 12:48
The complete turnaround on the blended learning plan after 24 hours was appalling.
We are dealing with a worldwide pandemic and the Scottish Government decided to use the herd immunity strategy while not only knowing that this virus is airborne but knowing that schools, secondary schools in particular will have no hope whatsoever of any social distancing measures.
The gross negligence shown by Nicola Sturgeon, Jason Leitch and John Swinney with their refusal to even acknowledge that the schools are a breeding ground for this virus is criminal.
What we do know about this virus is that it kills, it causes long term debilitating illnesses. We know people have lost limbs to this virus. We know people are left needing lung transplants. We know people are left with irreparable damage to their heart & lungs. We know teenagers are having to learn to walk again after being struck down with this virus. We know that there could be a link to male infertility. These are only a fraction of what we do know about this virus.
So why are the Scottish Government deeming that pupils, school staff and disabled family members are expendable.
This is revolting. Why should every other sector adhere to the FACTS but when it comes to schools FACTS have to be left at the school gates.
3 of my Grandchildren are severe asthmatics. 1 of my grandsons is severely disabled. My family have shielded as a whole for months to create a shield of protection around my Grandson. That shield has been broken by Scottish Government stating that my other grandchildren should return to full capacity high schools.
Scottish Government have failed the people of Scotland. You have failed in your duty of care to provide safe measures to keep the whole population safe, not only those that you choose to.
Blended learning may not even be a safe option now but it absolutely should have been the only option that was taken.
At the very least, families who have disabled/shielded members or pupils who have shielded themselves should have been given the option for their children to carry on with the online learning programme that was used throughout lockdown.
Your inability to even acknowledge these cases that are spreading like wildfire is negligent in your part.
Nicola Sturgeon said schools would only return if the numbers/levels were at a safe %
This was a blatant lie. You have introduced herd immunity when every decent scientist in the world will tell you that this is a recipe for disaster when we have no vaccine.
School pupils, school staff and the poor family members who have had to adhere to your turnaround on the blended learning plan will pay with their lives. This could have been avoided. Do something before it’s too late.
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Posted by Pipkins October 10, 2020 at 16:56
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Posted by MazKatzs October 11, 2020 at 13:52
The government may well have seen good practice, however getting pupils to social distance is questionable. Loads of steer on what teachers should be doing , not sharing IT and more, I've raised a few things including the positioning of my desk before return to school, as PC also needs moved...still waiting, none of these has been addressed...
I am more than happy to discuss off forum with someone....but much more needs to be achieved for all to be safe in school especially with current situation, which is likely to continue into the long winter.
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Posted by Coco12 October 11, 2020 at 13:57
Parents can not work effectively from home and properly care for and homeschool their children.
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Posted by LorraineF October 11, 2020 at 14:20
Yes he may be staying in halls and that may be deemed as forming a new household, but he is still a child and has definitely not left home. Please ensure that young people in this situation are able to return home to their families during the Christmas break without it being an offence.
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Posted by ShieldedMumAtRisk October 11, 2020 at 15:05
Scottish Government have completely failed in their duty of care to shielded pupils, school staff and at risk family members.
Scottish Government have to be held responsible for deciding to actively introduce herd immunity in schools.
Your blatant disregard and failure to share the correct data in relation to cases in schools speaks volumes . Your inability to make the only justifiable decisions for school pupils and staff only prove that you believe they are a worthy risk.
Nicola Sturgeon, Dr Gregor Smith and Jason Leitch all advocated for a full time return to schools with no social distancing measures in place only 24 hours after announcing a blended learning return.
The blended learning return is the only way forward. When will this happen? When pupils or staff lose their lives? Or will that be justified because they had “underlying health conditions”. Do the parents who are shouting for schools to remain open even know that an underlying health condition can be something as acute as childhood asthma?
Schools are not your babysitters. It is not up to the school staff to look after your children in the middle of a worldwide pandemic all so you can carry on working. These are your children and your responsibility. If you cannot work because the schools are moving to a blended learning plan then is not the government’s responsibility to fix your childcare issues.
Why should you be able to work while adhering to all social distancing measures while pupils and staff are being left to avoid a deadly virus with a window open and a bottle of hand gel?
Scottish Government have failed in their duty of care to allow all of the people in Scotland the ability to follow FACTS. Our schools are not equipped to deal with a deadly airborne virus.
I want my son in school but only in a safe and controlled environment. It is vital to his education that he is able to receive a mixture of online/face to face learning. However, Scottish Government deemed it safe for a full time return to a full capacity high school with no social distancing in place. It is not safe. COVID19 is in his school. COVID19 is in his year group.
My other son is in his final year of University and all work is being done online. Is this ideal? Probably not. However, we are in the middle of a deadly pandemic and on the scale of things his safety outweighs any education.
We, as a family are at risk. We are all asthmatics. However, my oldest son is severely disabled. As well as many other things, his lungs work at a capacity of 35% and he only has one working kidney. If this virus enters my home it is very likely my son will succumb to it.
This is why, as a family we shielded completely for 6 months. In fact 4 of us still do.
However, sadly not my youngest son. John Swinney, Nicola Sturgeon, Jason Leitch and Dr Gregor Smith seem to believe that COVID19 will not affect teenagers. Teenagers cannot be infected with this virus. Teenagers cannot transmit this virus home to immunocompromised family members. I must have missed this scientific evidence completely.
You are completely negligent.
You have a responsibility to share all TRUE data relating to cases in schools. Parents and staff need access to the full facts and figures that you are determined to conceal.
Lives will be lost. Young lives. School staff. Family members succumbing to a virus that is only penetrating their homes because of your inability to make the correct decision.
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Posted by santoc October 11, 2020 at 15:23
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Posted by Kelsoboy October 11, 2020 at 15:52
I think students should be allowed to mingle but keep the student bars separate. Lectures on line to keep staff safe.
With regards schools a blended model would suit the older high school kids and allow space for the others to spread out.
Primary school age being in full time doesn’t appear to have created a spike in cases so keep them in full time.
Any vulnerable staff should given a safe alternative
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Posted by Amcc October 11, 2020 at 16:52
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Posted by Whittijo October 11, 2020 at 17:07
As all children are being kept in school over lunchtime, the school is very busy all day even with staggered lunchtimes.
The mornings only approach is working well for us and might be a good model for other students.
Being autistic my daughter will struggle with some days at school and other days at home.
I realise there is no ideal solution here.
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Posted by DrEcon October 11, 2020 at 17:17
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Posted by Porkchops October 11, 2020 at 18:17
Signs in the playground do not stop parents/carers from entering.
Young children do not understand social distancing.
Blended learning would be best for the winter, you’ve provided the digital inclusion fund so let’s see how it works.
The hubs setup for Key Workers also put staff in an unsafe environment and these were being misused.
Staff were trying to teach online, man the hubs and help families each day. It was overload and a very stressful time for everyone I know who works in education.
Mandatory attendance for online lessons this time would make a difference - families need to engage. They have digital technology and dongles available through schools therefore no reason for families to not take part.
Those extra teachers you funded should support online learning across all authorities - where are they??
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Posted by TCoutts3 October 11, 2020 at 19:18
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Posted by Castle October 11, 2020 at 20:42
1. I am apprehensive about winter and feel that schools will need supported in maintaining good ventilation during this time - closing the windows because it’s cold is something that will happen but it’s only going to result in positivity rates increasing. This needs to be explained to teachers and pupils.
2. Provide easier, quicker testing to all - primary children not being tested/ providing inaccurate samples due to child being upset will mask numbers. Many people I know had their kids tested when general bugs spread round primary in August. I don’t know one child who found this pleasant - fortunately I’m amongst a group of parents who realise the importance of accurate sampling but I imagine that getting an accurate sample next tine won’t be easy - I believe that many either won’t choose to test or will keep their kids off school. This will falsely mask numbers of cases being spread in primary school.
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Posted by Castle October 11, 2020 at 20:46
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Posted by Castle October 11, 2020 at 20:57
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Posted by Mysay7 October 11, 2020 at 21:05
Current arrangements of return to full time education without more measures in place, is in my opinion, too high a risk for many families and school staff.
I recognise for some families a return to full time education in school feels essential in order to function and fulfil their work commitments, which I full respect. I also accept that some are not concerned about or they may be less risk averse about Covid-19 than others, but we also have families who feel the risk is too great for their household due to vulnerable health, or perhaps vulnerable circumstances (e.g. single parents with no fall-back position should they take ill and not be able to look after their children). Each is passionately defending their position as the correct one, so one arrangement cannot be the solution when it leaves either side so anxious about health/ household vulnerability/ their employment/ the economic impact/ their child’s education/ social interaction/ etc.
There needs to be choice in the system which allows for some to attend full time at school (additionality built into the previously run essential workers Hub arrangements) / some blended learning / and some temporary homeschooling in partnership with schools. Much messier than an ‘all or nothing’ approach, but by consulting families and then designing educational arrangement to take account of their needs and then effective planning, it could be done. It would enable us to more effectively work through this horrible period in a more respectful manner.
I completely agree that children need good education, but this can be provided in different ways including at home where skills, resources and capacity mean it is possible for parents to deliver it. A strict black or white approach of ‘in school full time’ or having to ‘formally withdraw your child from school for permanent homeschooling’ is not taking account of these very exceptional circumstances. Supportive temporary arrangements need to be available to families.
If wider options aren’t forthcoming, then, if, as I’m hearing, the Teachers Unions are insisting that teachers with class commitments should not be required to prepare work for pupils to do at home where a parent has not felt able to send their child back to school, then additional resource needs to be made available at local authority level to support those families to sustain the relationship with school, class and classwork during this temporary period.
This support would take account of the very differing circumstances of families and would avoid parents feeling forced to formally withdraw their child from school education or feeling forced to send their children and live in fear of their household vulnerability being tested in the knowledge that this could for many, with no fall back support, mean contemplating their children having to be cared for by ‘the system’. That simply isn’t an acceptable position to place people in.
For those who dismiss this as a concern- you clearly are the fortunate ones who have a fellow parent/ grandparents/ extended family or friends that you’re confident would care for your children should you become ill. Many parents (especially single parents of children with complex needs for whom in non-Covid times a babysitter for a few hours is elusive, never mind full time care of their child should they become ill) this is a very real and distressing reality. We need options that the current arrangements are not providing.
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