Is this conversation a waste of time?

There have been a lot of good and practical suggestions put forward as part of this grown up discussion we are having with the Scottish Government. It sounded like this was going to be a very good consultation. Now, I have just heard Nicola Sturgeon on television saying there will be no changes in the lockdown any time soon (In spite of Boris Johnson saying some measures are going to be eased in England this week) This is going to anger a lot of Scots. Lets be clear, we are not asking for the important things to be lifted, neither is Boris. All we would like to see as a first step is some easing of what we can do in our spare time in the form of activities that do not pose a risk of spreading the virus. But Nicola says no. But crucially she has said no before even waiting for this consultation process to finish, and she made no mention that this consultation is going to influence the decisions. So it sounds like the decision is made and this conversation is now a wast of time and is not going to influence the decisions that have already been made. That is very disappointing if true.

Why the contribution is important

The Scottish people need to see things are moving forwards, first in small steps, allowing more freedom to do things that have no risk of spreading the virus. This is needed for the mental health of those trying to live withing the restrictions and to make it more bearable. If nothing changes then it will send the message that this conversation was a waste of time, is not being listened to and the Scottish Government have no regard for the feelings of the people. If the people feel they are being ignored they will lose respect for the Scottish Government and the restrictions that are in place.

by Dave_H on May 10, 2020 at 07:46PM

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Comments

  • Posted by Magic May 10, 2020 at 19:57

    This is not just a no, it is a no full stop like we are 5 years old. We need to do this together as we have done so far. The minor measures suggested by Boris are harmless. It has been suggested by scientists that the virus does not transmit outdoors. We have a lot of open spaces in this country so being allowed to play some sport and sunbathe makes more sense.

  • Posted by MF123 May 10, 2020 at 20:04

    Most comments and votes have been to ease the lockdown open garden centres open construction and dentists. If these measures don't happen then she will have ignored the majority and this exercise will have been a total waste of time and will show that she doesn't listen or care what the people want

  • Posted by Opportunity May 10, 2020 at 20:08

    I don't think it is a waste of time. Some poor civil servant has to read through this and note some points which may need addressing. They will probably also gauge where the public opinion goes. And this is naturally divided. Finally, they will make up their mind, what the science says, how unruly some people may become (although they are simply asked to stay put which is not really difficult with all the support everybody can get if needed) and they will (hopefully) also watch what is happening elsewhere before they rush into something. Only to mention the most prominent examples who are experiencing a rise in cases since they eased their restrictions: Germany and South Korea. We have lessons to learn from them. And we should keep in mind that definitely Germany's health care system cannot be compared with the NHS. It is better equipped, including financially and with enough staff, but we are vulnerable. The NHS could only 'cope' because it had the additional weight of normal scheduled treatments taken off it... and because many elderly were not even admitted to hospitals but died in their care homes. Certainly nothing to be proud of. No, this consultation is not a waste of time. Some posts may be but they will probably end up on the 'unsubstantiated' pile anyway.

  • Posted by jennyw May 10, 2020 at 20:10

    I listened to both the Prime Minister and Nicola Sturgeon. Both messages were very clear to me. I agree fully with Nicola Sturgeon approach and think it is right for the people of Scotland. She could not be any clearer. As she stated, Scotland stats are lagging behind England. She also stated its not an exact science but an estimate based on the current figures and trend. So she is quite right to er on the side of caution not only to prevent more deaths and protect the NHS but how foolish would it be to prematurely relax and end up worse than ever, undoing all the efforts of everyone. She is the first Minister for Scotland put in office by the public to lead, so support her in this very difficult task please. Just for the record, I am not an SNP supporter.

  • Posted by petermuir79 May 10, 2020 at 20:15

    Agree, is this pointless. I get the feeling that the Scottish Government just wants to say the opposite to Boris as....its Boris.

  • Posted by OldDeuteronomy May 10, 2020 at 20:16

    This discussion indeed sounded interesting and a positive way forward, although I now suspect that you're correct in thinking that it's a purely political operation to theoretically keep the populous sustained through these times of 'quiet' albeit which will be kept at arm's length from any policies.

  • Posted by Lorraine10 May 10, 2020 at 20:19

    The Scottish people realise the number of new cases need to reduce first before we formally start lifting lockdown. Let’s face it with garden centres opening up, burger kings, McDonalds, take aways and coffee shops all reopening , its not exactly lock down is it? We are supposed to all be in this to support the NHS. If the R number increases as it has done in other countries who have reduced lockdown restrictions then we will be at a value which will inundate our NHS capacity to cope. Therefore a few more weeks of lockdown I am sure people will agree, people can cope with especially now as exercise has been permitted to increase , will help the elderly, help the immune compromised, help ALL of The front line workers and help the country fight the virus until such time as we can all get a vaccine. We are all impatient to get back to some sort of normality but patience and control of our feelings and emotions is what we must do. Look at all the poor families who have lost loved ones, they can’t have them back...

  • Posted by MikeJohnston May 10, 2020 at 20:21

    Boris has blown it, big time, and in front of the whole world. (Hope this does not offend the Moderators.) Publicly, Scot, W and NI have stuck with what is (to some extent, excl TTIS) working and while I'm not the FM's greatest fan, I commend her for this. However, as said above, this 'Grown-up Conversation' may easily become yet another sham. I suggest we all use Tuesday 12th to email every MSP demanding a full and frank assessment of the 'conversation'. The clue is in the name. Are we the naughty children or grown ups? (We don't have anything else useful to do on the 12th do we?) The ScottishGovernment nickname has seeded some 'ideas' which are at the top of the 'most commented' list. How about their coming out publicly on this conversation with some replies? Otherwise it's just another one-way conversation - evidenced by a complete refusal of all scot.gov and MSP email addresses to reply to my emails.

  • Posted by Kylesku May 10, 2020 at 20:27

    I would be very surprise if anything posted here changes Nicolas thinking, on teh other hand anythgin here supporting her policies will be warmly welcomed.

  • Posted by KJF May 10, 2020 at 20:32

    I do necessarily agree with everything the Scottish Government do but in my opinion she is absolutely and positively correct to keep this lockdown in place at present. We are 1-2 weeks behind London in respect of numbers of cases and the curve of this disease. Therefore, the UK government (English!) have the luxury of easing the restrictions as the numbers in their hot spots are declining, but in Scotland our numbers and the curve are only STARTING to decline, nevermind in a meaningful way.

  • Posted by Ro2 May 10, 2020 at 20:32

    Waste of time is a relative concept. The ideas I have posted on this forum turn out to have all the buoyancy of the proverbial lead balloon. Never the less I find it very interesting to take part in this process and read what other people have to say. This system appears to be based on an on-line system for gauging public opinion that was pioneered by the Taiwanese government last year. I remember reading about it at the time and having a good look at it. The great advantage is that it can give a government an almost instant idea of what goes on in the minds of its people on a particular topic. The pitfalls I think are to with how the information is graded: Ideas that generate the best votes and the most responses float to the top and are mentioned in the summing-up. These are almost always the simplest, snappiest, and more outspoken ideas. I suspect there is a kind of filter-bubble effect going on, similar to what happens in social media. No surprise, because this is modelled on social media. The longer, more complex and nuanced reflections on a topic, including mine, tend to sink to the bottom of the heap into oblivion once the window of attention of a few hours has passed. What I am typing now will undoubtedly go the same way. Cheers!

  • Posted by Cheryl May 10, 2020 at 20:38

    I am sure Nicola Sturgeon said that lockdown measures were in place for three weeks but restrictions could be lifted earlier if the evidence suggests it is safe to do so. These discussions will give scotgov an idea of what contributors are thinking and look at the arguments for and against each suggestion.

  • Posted by mummywebb May 10, 2020 at 20:39

    I agree this ‘dialogue’ is quite frankly a joke it’s patronising and seems to be having little impact on our path out of this mess. Ask for opinion when it’s already been decided .... to do nothing for another 3 weeks. No plans. No framework. And frankly no desire to try and ‘do’ anything .... It’s ironic BoJo thwarted a second referendum and yet is happy for us to make our own path to economic and civil destruction leaving children, teenagers, students, the ill (well apart from Covid obvs), the elderly, those with mental health issues, the economy to be left behind suddenly we have a separate nation but no benefit of being independent. We need a visionary leader who can guide us through this and address HOW we will get the economy going, the schools open, the NHS open to ALL, protect the vulnerable.

  • Posted by BT May 10, 2020 at 20:44

    Boris is more worried about the economy than people. He’s not interested in you. There printing and borrowing billions which will all have to be repaid. Just put up with it for a little bit longer.

  • Posted by JaneySue May 10, 2020 at 21:13

    Very disappointed that this dialogue has not influenced Nicola’s decision. She asked us what we needed, we’ve told her some low risk changed that would reap huge benefits and we are told no by am angry Nicola. So please listen to the population Nicola and let us see people outside and get back to work safely.

  • Posted by Tom9nn May 10, 2020 at 21:26

    Allow the consultation process to finish before being so negative. I'm sure our opinions will be considered.

  • Posted by ArchieM May 10, 2020 at 21:38

    This was yet another con trick by this Scottish Government. No doubt the “leadership” will state it was listening to the public. Just like it said it would have a “ grown up conversation with the public”, I must have missed that one. Still do not understand why we are told the R number had to come down, when we don’t even know what it is, how high it has been and exactly what the target is. We were told there would e a road map, where is this road map, meanwhile our economy will continue to fall behind and more damage will be done including damage to mental health.

  • Posted by Ccd May 10, 2020 at 21:41

    Produce the evidence that this exercise has been worthwhile and comments have been considered and acted upon and not ignored Why the contribution is important To gain public support and belief that their opinion counts

  • Posted by dodo1956 May 11, 2020 at 00:06

    I totally agree with Nicola to be cautious and keep lockdown in place at present but it would be nice if she had at least acknowledged the number of 'grown ups' who have been contributing to this conversation. Hopefully we are not speaking to ourselves. I have been really interested in other people's comments and the most obvious one that stands out is that people need contact with families or friends more than anything. Yet neither Nicola or Boris even make a reference to where this lies in their future plans or road maps - very depressing.

  • Posted by Abigail May 11, 2020 at 00:23

    Right now I have far more confidence in the Scottish government's management of the pandemic than I do in that of the UK government. Until R is very low, there are huge risks attached to lifting lockdown; also it is unrealistic to expect any government to act on a consultation started less than a week ago.

  • Posted by Scotland_is_flatlining May 11, 2020 at 18:28

    Most concerned that this is a delaying tactic. Having seen the FM put out the framework for decision making on 23 April nothing has changed in the following 3 weeks. Scottish Government is ineffiient, not fit for purpose and should give way to Westminster.
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